Ep 82: Healing your relationship to the Masculine & why we love in person work

In this episode, Meg and Jacob O’Neill share their real struggles with anger, emotions, and diving deep into the messy, beautiful reality of love and intimacy.

Meg opens up about how women often hold in anger, leading to bottled-up feelings and frustration. She and Jacob discuss their different ways of handling anger and how it shapes their relationship. It’s a powerful reminder that communication is a key driver to deeper intimacy and more meaningful connection with your partner.

Imagine the magic of connecting face-to-face. Meg describes hosting an in-person event as “glorious” and “life-changing.” These gatherings create deep bonds and healing, especially for women seeking more in their relationships. Jacob reflects on the healing power of coming together especially when healing core parts of you and doing "inner work" in the support of a community.

They stress the need for honesty, vulnerability, and focusing on women’s empowerment in relationships. Meg talks about how relaxing and letting go are key to feeling deep pleasure and connection. She encourages you to create a “blueprint” in your body for this feeling.

They also riff off on: 

• Meg O'Neill discusses how women often internalize anger and frustration in relationships.
• Internalized anger leads to the suppression of emotions and a lack of expression.
• Jacob O'Neill reflects on the power of coming together for healing and growth.
• Meg and Jacob talks about how the most powerful healing occurs in subtle moments rather than loud or intense releases.
• Meg O'Neill shares the importance of expressing hurt in a safe space for women.
• Meg and Jacob discuss the importance of clearing emotional baggage for personal growth and liberation.
• Meg O'Neill encourages women to create a blueprint of their immersive experiences to recall and practice later.
• Trust and support are crucial in creating meaningful experiences.
• Relaxation and letting go are keys to feeling deep pleasure and connection.
• The importance of balancing online work with in-person interactions to enhance the depth of connections.
• Highlighting the ceremonial nature of gatherings designed to deepen understanding and connection among participants.

and many, many more.

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IG: @the.meg.o @thejacoboneill @sexloveeverythinginbetween

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⚡ Want more? Here are some of the offerings & courses you can join us in…

CLAIMED: An in-person event who wants to feel deeply claimed by their partner: https://meg-oneill.com/claimed-immersion

Pleasure Portal: 14 day event - https://meg-oneill.com/pleasure-portal

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Ignite Your Intimacy: A 4 week course for couples ready for a sexier, wilder, more ALIVE relationship… NOW! --->https://meg-oneill.com/ignite-your-intimacy

***Jacob & Meg also coach individuals & couples. Reach out to them via Instagram for more information

Transcript

1:07

And when we as women give up this, like trying so hard, like my partner must understand me, he needs to get me right. I'm he's not getting me right, that's, that's that could, that's such a heady experience. But when we actually just focus on, oh, my job is to let him feel me. My job as a woman is to be a felt fucking experience like that changes a woman's fucking life. She becomes more expressed. She uses her body in different ways. She becomes more like liberated and animated and alive in the way that she moves through the world, and this is in and outside of partnership. Yo, yo, yo. Lovers. Welcome, welcome. Welcome to sex, love and everything in between, where the O'Neills you're here with Megan Jacob, and this is the place we have really uncensored conversations about sex, intimacy and relationships. We're super excited you're here. Enjoy this episode. Hey, Mama. Hey, hey daddy, Big Daddy. Hey, hey, Big Daddy. How you feeling? Big Daddy. I'm frustrated today you are. Oh yeah, yeah, laugh about it. I think we've spoken about this on the podcast before, about anger and and, you know, dealing with our partners anger in relationship. And, you know, it's one thing to have your partner projecting anger at you, and that's I'm not talking about that, but I'm just talking about when your partner is angry about something, or frustrated about something, I used to just like, make you feel so wrong for that, because I wasn't comfortable with anger, and I wasn't comfortable with my own anger, but you would experience anger, and you might be like, fuck, ah, and you'd just be saying it to yourself, or you'd just be expressing it And let that energy move. And I used to really shame you, I wouldn't say that your I would say our families are very different in the way that we process anger. How would you I would say neither of them are healthy. I would say we, our family is just so destructive. You're very outward, yes, yeah. Projection, lots of projections, lots of finger pointing that occurs on my family's end. Yeah, my family is more. Let's hold it in until let's Yeah. I don't even think your families have has the big blow ups as much? No, I think it's just like, maybe let the anger eat away. Yeah, I didn't really experience a lot of anger growing up, but no, I would say no, maybe, maybe it was anger, but it wasn't as volatile. Yes, yeah, I'll say the anger in my home growing up was volatile. It was volatile. Anyway, what I was getting at was I was in the bath just a few hours ago, and you had written, had what? Yeah, well, I from what I could tell me what I did. You'd written a whole lot of content in Kajabi, and then it didn't say, probably, and it was like hours of work. It's not that it didn't say properly. I accidentally hit the expert because I had too many tabs open. That sucks. I thought it just like, you know, Kajabi times out sometimes, or I thought it was also, it wasn't even like, you couldn't even be like, Fuck you, Kajabi. I'm still a bit of a I'm like, why doesn't this motherfucker have an autosave like Google? Yes, all about the autosave. Anyway, you were really, I was lying in the bath, and you were really having an expression session. No, that was nothing. But, yeah, I've learned that's a big thing. I've learned to just, like, not take that personally at all, and even, like, maybe 1520 minutes later, I got out of the bath, and I came into your office and I I wanted to, just like, I think I started to touch your neck and like, I just said, like, I'm really sorry you lost everything. And you were like, just, I just need time please leave. Like, okay, and I would have, there would have been a point in our relationship where it would have taken that so personally. And today, is he crying? Does he want to leave this room today? Yeah, it's just like, that's not about me, like, just like, the best way to love him right now is to offer him the space. And we had a good laugh over lunch. I'm still feeling anger. I'm not laughing yet. You are. Look, you're laughing for both of us. Yeah, you were being light about it. Well, you don't laugh. You cry, but oh gosh, yeah, anger is and it's just like, it's it's more so when I'm doing something that I don't that I really struggle. And when I like, I struggle to create, like I'm good at facilitating. I'm great at facilitating, but when it comes to, like, sitting down and building up programs that sort of stuff, I find that to be such a drag. Yeah, and that then led to, like, me back, I was, like, getting really excited that I'd nearly finished one of the fucking modules. And, all right, I'll let him out like our dog is climbing all over me. No Django, so guys, if you So, we're just talking about Jacob's frustration, and our dog is just jumped over a cord and pushed the whole camera and everything over. Don't worry about the 1000s of dollars worth of gear that I bought for this man. Maybe this episode is is trying to take us in a totally different direction to where we first thought. Maybe today is just like a like. I don't know what I'm gonna do, if like, if like, I'm gonna love that baby in your belly. But I'm also so, so concerned about, like, all of the I'm so materialistic when it comes to my things. Yeah, I'm like, I don't know if you'd call it even, yeah, maybe it is a sense of being materialistic. You're just like, when you get something, you take such good care of it, and you become very attached to it. And, yeah, well, I get something and, like, destroy it immediately. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not great with looking after my possessions. Like, I'll buy a really expensive outfit and, like, you know, chocolate all over something expensive. The other night, I was like, Oh, well, I'm gonna thrive in parenthood for that reason. No, well, it makes my whole neck, the whole body's so tense right now. It makes me think like, yeah, I don't know whether that's a wound or good or whatever about me, but anyway, fuck all. Right, I think we need that in our relationship, because you do take care of things. I would love for both of us to take care of things. That's my dream. Is like that also, I think there needs to be someone like me in the relationship. It's kind of like, oh, well, let's not worry about it. No, I would, I would disagree with that, but that might be for another podcast. Okay, we can do it live on live on air. Honestly, the the anger thing, very real for me right now. So that was perfect, obviously. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Django, you, you, you're, you're my greatest teacher. Could have just grabbed him then and just, Oh, I feel like everything's preparing us for parenthood, though, you know that sort of stuff. Yeah, it's like, I'm just imagining, like coming in here and seeing, like a cup of water just tipped straight on top of the gosh, well, I think we'll have the podcast room somewhere else where the child can't go. Oh, we might, or we might not. We'll see. Are you gonna do anything about it? Just gonna leave everything everywhere you guys could see this loud room right now, yoga room, her red light room and her office, all in all, because we have a heater in this room. And I like, Yeah, I do do a lot in here. And then I haven't unpacked from my immersion yet either. So that was a week and a bit ago, just put in the garage like I do. I want to circle back around like, the valuing things. I just want to tell a quick story, two quick story. Two quick stories. I remember my great aunt, Auntie Joan, her partner, Frank. He showed me a fry pan that he got. He bought. It was the first thing that he bought for his wife when they moved in and there was a fry pan, and he was still using it up until the day died. And I think he got married in his late 20s. So he'd had a fry pan for like, 70 years, yeah, close to 70 years. And he was just using it over and over again. He's like, Yep, this is what. This was the best. He's like, and I think it cost him a week, almost a week's wages, wow. And he's and she's, and remembering saying, if you buy the right one once, you won't have to buy it again. And I think I'm very I've always been a bit like, I like to look after my things. Yeah, because I maybe because I want to one day, like, when I'm 90, like, Oh, cool. Look at this. I've still got it, and it's still in good nick and, yeah, and I'm. Also that person in my Yeah, I'm very particular in my family around that sort of stuff. No one else is. Would you as much? No, not as much, no. So that's, that's one story. So shout out to Frank. Rest in peace. Frank. He died a few years ago, and he was a really strong, strong presence in my life. And I loved, I loved the stories that he shared, especially that one. And the other one was, I went fishing with my dad, and he's had this, it's called a bull whip, and it's a fishing rod he's had for ages, since he, like, since before I was born, I think. And I went fishing, and he's like, Oh yeah, just use that. And I said, Oh, cool. Just used it. And this was a couple of years ago, and I remember just flicking a lure out, and the lure got caught on a snag, and I just went like that, and I just snapped the rod in half, and I came back around, so I've just snapped your rod. He's like, oh well. I was like, no, like, that's bad, like you have to be angry, like you'd be easy. Oh well, I've had that most of my life. Mate, what would you do to it? I was like, I can't talk about it. I said I can't handle breaking other people's stuff. Like, I your dad genuinely wouldn't have cared. I don't know, like, but your dad's a bit like, oh, we move on. Yeah, no. Like, your dad doesn't really sit in stuff. Your dad's just like, no point. Yeah, fuck it, yeah, yeah, I love that about your dad. Yeah, you and him are awfully not not, but not in looks, obviously, but guys, but yeah, I'm feeling regulated now, guys, so we can start the podcast. Thank you for your story. Does storytelling regulate you? Yeah, grounds me, gives me, helps me locate myself in time and space. You're back. You're grounded, yep. Okay, what do we what do we want to talk about? Let's talk about, I wanted to get so much done today, and I've done fuck all any like, I don't even want to be on this. I've got other things. I didn't sleep last night. Last night sleep. I was just stressed. And I Yeah, and I was, I looked at the latest the it was, was like two quarter past two, about, yeah, barely slept last night, and then I didn't know that, yeah, and then you've just been annoying me all day. Yeah, haven't you felt that? No, oh, really, I've been kind of annoyed at you for no reason, just for existing. Well, yeah, I felt like but I don't think that's about me. I think that's more about what you've been meeting through. Yeah, 100% so yeah, I haven't taken that personally, have you haven't been that great? No, I haven't been taking that personally. But, um, I'm complete. Like, you mean, like, podcast done? Yeah, I'm gonna go for go have a beer. No, I would really like to talk about, not what went down. It claimed. I'd really love to talk about, you know, the profound nature of the work that you offer, and what you know, and you know, the potency and the healing that can occur when we come together and create a safe space. And, yeah, I'm really, as you all know, I'm pretty passionate about men's work and bringing men together to do the work in brotherhood, but for me to come in and and to support and facilitate for the women, it really showed me the the necessary part of coming together as men and women, and where that's going to start to take place more in our work, I believe. And I kind of got a little glimpse into the future of our work, which was a really beautiful experience, not that we're going to be working together. Don't give me working together. Don't get any ideas. What do you mean? What do you mean the future of our work? I can just see how it will come. I can see the healing of the healing nature of coming back together after doing the work with the men and the women, doing the work with the women. I can see where it can be really easy to stay in that dynamic. I only do the work with the men. I only do the work with the women. And there's this new kind of, this new belief in me though, this, this re this remembering of like, Ah, okay, there's going to be a time when we come together and do this work alongside each other in a really deep way. And I've wondered why we haven't done it yet, and I think it's because we weren't ready. I think we've been deepening separately so beautifully, and then to come in and witness the women and be a part of that in and, you know, I've been a part of a lot of the online programs that you've had as well, and that's been really beautiful. But this, this one, just felt different. It felt like, Oh, we're actually going, this is now becoming part of my work as well, not just your work. And I'm, I'm coming in to be a part of, I can see that there's something that wants to, that's that's growing. Yeah, it was so it was. So fucking beautiful. Yeah, I hadn't done anything in person for like, a really long like, we'd had the podcast party, but in terms of facilitating something in person, I hear that was another funny thing, that we had our podcast party earlier in the year, and the podcast didn't record at the podcast party, so it was really shitty audio. Yay. That's being in business, though there's like, things that just do, well, that's life. Things don't work out sometimes, yeah, and who are you when they don't work out? I'm a so I am. I embody the temperature of the Sun internally, and I scorched myself. Anyway, I hadn't facilitated anything in person for, like, a very fucking long time. So so much of my business has been built online, which I love. Love being in a Zoom Room with women. I love the ease of, you know, creating, and you know, so much of my work, there's women from all over the globe. You really have a, like, a global community, my gosh, full spectrum. Woman, with all of your work, it's such a global sisterhood in full spectrum. Woman, we have women in like India, where else? Germany, Canada, America, New Zealand, Australia, like all these other places in Europe, like Sweden, you know, there's just women like all over the fucking world. It's so cool. And yeah, so that's the beautiful part of being online. But I was feeling, I was feeling this call. It was a few months ago. I was in my second trimester, and I was on a call with my team, Megan and Mel. And I said to them, Hey, I actually want to do an in person event, and it'll be in my third trimester, and they're both mothers. I said, What do you reckon? And Megan, she was like, No. I was like, Am I crazy? Because we'll also be launching full spectrum woman, and we'll be doing this and we're doing that. And I think Megan was like, No. And then Mel was quite new to my team at the time, so I don't really think she shared much. And I was like, I'm gonna do it anyway. And I think I put a thing on an Instagram story on or a story on Instagram, being like, do you? Yeah? Am I is trimester three Meg going to regret, or, like, be mad at trimester two meg for making this decision? But I wasn't. I literally even just on day one of the immersion. So it was an in person immersion I held last weekend on the Gold Coast, and oh my god, it was just like the most glorious experience ever. I am so fucking glad I chose that before giving birth. I think it's really going to change the trajectory of my work next year. Like when I do come back after being in a baby bubble for a few months, like I just want to be in person with humans and inject that so much more into into my work and how I be with women, because there's something so fucking special about being able to, like, touch someone there, and like, hug someone and, you know, facilitate in, like, somatically, but like, be with the women's bodies. It's, it was, it was just such a fucking stunning unfolding of a three days experience, and you were a huge part of that, and when you came in, huge part of that. Thank you. It's just, it's, it's really cool to, I think there is, there's been such a a for me, entrepreneurship has been so focused as, like, it has to be online, or it has to be passive, or it's all about getting away from, you know, doing more. And for me, I've quite enjoy work. I quite enjoy the processes. I quite enjoy being in the room or being in on the calls like that, to me, is fulfilling. So yeah, when you chose to do that, I was super excited for you, because I knew how, how deeply can impact the work that you are offering online as well. It's very much not one or the other. It's both. And I really, truly believe that as we start to deepen and create these in person experiences as facilitators, it like it just translates so much more powerfully online then, because we're in it and we're living it. And I would say that, you know, for the first what six years? What are six years? What do we the first like five, five to six years of our our journey in this kind of facility, like being in facilitated spaces, like we were very actively going to things we were very actively, like, sitting in ceremonial, being in the in the somatic space. Hello, they just kicked when you said ceremony. Yeah, really good. And that for me is like, that's what it brings through for me, like it a. And really wants, has me wanting to show up and create more online when I am actually connected to something in person as well, completely. So, yeah, more in person experiences coming 2025 I probably have a baby on my boob while I'm facilitating next time. Yeah, yeah. Excited about that. Yeah, I'm really excited about that. Oh yeah, tell us, what was your what were some of your favorite moments from claimed? Oh, that was so fucking many. I adored the healing your relationship to the masculine ceremony, which you, which you've, we co facilitated, and I don't want to share too much of like, what goes down in that experience, because it's, yeah, such a sacred it's such a sacred ceremony. But you come in and you, you know, you represent the masculine, whatever that needs to be for each woman. And yeah, it's just just like so fucking powerful to hold space for women to heal and for women to feel, and for women to be expressed and to feel, feel parts of themselves and also feel, um, feel unfelt things, right, things that have lived in their body for sometimes decades, that they haven't felt safe enough to feel yet, like that's liberation, like that's that ceremony is watching A woman liberate herself. And a woman doesn't just liberate herself once she liberates her whole entire life can become, you know, a complete devotion to liberation. But that ceremony is just so stunning to witness the liberation that can go down in a woman's body. And so much of that entire three days was really about women. You know, it was called claim. So it's about wanting to be claimed and chosen and cherished and ravished in partnership. But a huge part of that is, if you desire that in partnership, you've got to become a woman that's willing to be fully expressed and be fully felt. That was a huge part of what I was teaching at claim to what we were really dropping into is like as women, we're not actually here to be understood or even digestible. We're here to be felt. And when we as women give up this, like trying so hard, like my partner must understand me. He needs to get me right. I'm he's not getting me right. That's, that's, that's such a heady experience. But when we actually just focus on, oh, my job is to let him feel me. My job as a woman is to be a felt fucking experience like that changes a woman's fucking life. She becomes more expressed. She uses her body in different ways. She becomes more like liberated and animated and alive in the way that she moves through the world. And this is in and outside of partnership. So I'm kind of going on a tangent here, but that was actually another one of my favorite things is we did a lot of, like, playtime experiences where women had opportunities to be an expression, like be in partnered activities and be an expression, and, you know, bring through their desires with their body and with their voice, you know, moving out of, like being passive aggressive, or, You know, maybe bringing something to the relationship. You know, if they're disappointed or hurt in their relationship, maybe closing down or contracting or storming away, we practiced kind of those, what's your usual pattern? And then we moved into like, Okay, can you? Can you be a felt experience in this moment? Can you practice this, like, feminine responsiveness? And that was just so fun to witness. The women, like every single woman there, just fucking brought it, and, you know, met her edges and brought herself. And as a facilitator, like and I said this again and again during that weekend, like an in person event, yes, it has something to do with the facilitator, but then again, it doesn't. It's so determined by the women or the people in that room and their devotion to bringing themselves and leaning in and yeah, it was fucking stunning. And then have many, many, many more favorite moments. But I'll just pause there. I feel that when you do facilitate something like that. The beauty of it is having those three days, you kind of get to create an arc. You get to create a journey that you all go on, and that, for me, is what I love so much about, like an in person event, is that it becomes this deepening, rather than this, like, where are we? You know, what am I delivering, and how am I getting you there? And. When you have three days to really deepen into like, one particular piece around, like, being claimed and and becoming a space for that, it's, it's so beautiful when you can actually take your time and be and like, what I would say is, like you said, it has nothing to do with the facilitation, I would disagree, and that it has everything to do with the facilitation. Yeah, yeah. I do agree, in a way, but it's not I mean that in the way of like, it's not just me standing up there the whole time teaching. It's like also, yeah, the women choosing to bring themselves so deeply to that experience. Finish what I was saying. I can sorry. I was going to say that it has everything to do with the facilitation and the facilitator doing less, needing to be the teacher, needing to, you know, get people somewhere. You teach me so much about that in your in the way you facilitate. I think that's part of facilitation. I think that's like what parenthood is probably going to be like as well. We wanted to have dinner here, and we want to do it at this time, and this is how we wanted it to look. And it's not happening that way, and that's okay. Your ability, when you hold space, to let go and let life move through the space, is fucking phenomenal. And you really because as a recovering high achiever and woman that loves to be in control, not so much anymore, but that's definitely where I've come from. There is this part of me, in the past, in my business, that wants like, everything planned and everything structured and everyone's like, everyone's safe, is everyone having good time? Is everyone feeling like wanting to micromanage everyone's experience, and just like witnessing the way you hold space and your ability to trust the humans that are in the room, and also your ability to trust life and how it wants to move in the space, and maybe redirect the schedule, or redirect some of the energy, or whatever that might look like, that taught me. That's taught me so much, and that's shifted the way I facilitate, as you know, online and in person, I'm really grateful for that. Thank you. And yeah, I think that you are, I think you have a really beautiful balance of both, thank you. And even after we after day one, when you came back and you were like, you had a little moment of being like, oh, did I? Did I give them everything that I wanted to, like, tickle all the things off the list. And then you were like, sort of went into this little moment of just, like, critical analysis of self, yeah. And I was like, I was like, hang on. You dare speak to my my wife like that. You dare speak to her like that. And what, what that? What you wrote, like, about 30 seconds later, you were then dropping in, talking about all of the amazing things that had actually occurred, and you're like, Oh, if you had have stuck to the script, if you had have gotten everything done that you wanted, of wanted to, you would have missed out on all of these things that were emerging. That's what I love about. Like a space is like when you circle up and you stand and you all make a commitment to stepping in for three days and leaning into edges and finding where the where the kinks and the resistance and the shadows are. There is an emerging truth that must be honored. If a facilitator cannot honor that emerging truth that they're just becoming another control freak or another person that can't let go, therefore the space is limited by your own conditioning. And this is huge. You know, I'm teaching guys at the moment, teaching nine guys in our facilitator training who are going to come along and support us at the gathering of men. And a big part of the conditioning that I see in the work is that it has to look a certain way. It has to follow a certain process and a certain formula. Whereas we've been really big on creating frameworks and intuitive structures for the men to feel their way through and get to understand what it means to be with the living, breathing entity. That can be the ceremonial nature of you could be teaching on anything, but there is always going to be a ceremonial nature when you come to nature when you come together to deepen. And that's attunement, right? Yeah, and that takes practice. And I also, like we speak so much about that here on the podcast, in terms of intimacy and relationship, yes, right? It's like, can, instead of like, let's look at sex. It's like, oh, we had this plan for sex. We went on a date, and now we're in the bedroom, and I thought sex was going to unfold perfectly. And now actually, there's emotion here, or there's contraction here, or there's something else here, and you know, a masterful facilitator in that moment, or a masterful like relationship practitioner, is going to not just try and force the perfect sex to happen. They're going to be like, Oh, I'm going to honor what's here right now, and I'm going to trust that that's where my energy needs to be. And I've got to say yes to that in order to go where, you know where I want to go. So yeah, it's the same with facilitation. And, yeah. Yeah, again, I think that takes such such practice. And I think often, you know, I know a lot of women and men that own businesses and are in the coaching industry and are holding space listen to the podcast. And I think that sometimes having a structure is really important. To be like, where am I taking my people? Oh, definitely. Where am I guiding them? But then to be able to, you know, practice the art of, yeah, attunement and, and, yeah, like taking the pulse of a space and being able to be flexible enough to, it's flexible enough, but then it's, was that nice? It was a car be flexible enough, but also there's like, a huge trust piece in it. Yeah, I think that's why I'm like learning and I think this is, this is deepened even more during pregnancy. It's just like such a depth of trust in my work, in my business, in life, again, I think it's the way I'm choosing to do this pregnancy. I'm not we're not seeing I haven't seen a doctor. We haven't seen any medical practitioner. It's like me and the baby and like that. I've got to trust life. Yeah, I'm not trusting someone to give me a structure or tell me what to do. It's like I'm trusting life. And yeah, I feel that even more deeply through my work at the moment too, it's been really beautiful, and structure is important to a point, yeah, and structure is, is is necessary. It's just the rigidity of that structure, or the force, the forcefulness, or the forcing nature behind that structure that can really make or or break a space. And I've been in spaces where there hasn't been enough structure and the facilitation hasn't actually guided the it hasn't had enough containment. And that's important as well, and that's why framing is so important, I think. And I don't know why I'm doing how to how to facilitate, but that's what I love about the way that you lead women in, is there is a lot of there is a lot of framing and giving women an understanding of what it is that they're stepping into, and what they're saying yes to, and what the what this opportunity will afford them. Should they meet their edge or, you know, expand beyond the window of tolerance and see what's there. Yeah, yeah, there's and I think this is definitely, specifically when someone's holding space for women. Like, you know, safety is important for every human, but the work I do with women, it's like in you know, that healing your relationship to the masculine ceremony, big stuff arises for women, like, really, really big stuff. And it is like, safety. I'm not in my work. I'm never the kind of person that's gonna like, let's have this huge cathartic experience, and let's bring out the deepest trouble. Like, no, it's like, if a woman, if that arises in a woman's body, and she is like, I can see that oftentimes, when something is there and I will invite her, but it's always an invitation. And I think that's so important in in this in this work as well, that like, especially for women, know that it's always an invitation, and they're not being forced into these huge experiences when, yeah, they might not feel safe to Yeah, yeah, there's no I think it can be quite easy to fall into the somatic space or the in person space, and think the louder, the more intense, the more graphic, the more almost obscene the release is, the better. But the more I personally do this work, it's in the subtleties. It's in the subtleties that if you're which comes back to attunement, and if you have fierce presence, you can support someone in a way that they don't necessarily have to get somewhere or get to where you think they need to get to. Some people have to, have to kick and scream and go through, go through that. And that's that's part of the process, if that's their process. But it's not a one size fits all. I love that when it's like releasing and I think this is so important when you're working somatically with someone, and this is so true for how I show up in full spectrum woman, when I'm group coaching, when I'm guiding women like in person and online, is that, you know, I have learned that I'm like, if I'm like, ignoring the truth of the moment and trying to get a woman to a particular place that is, that's not masterful coaching, or that's not masterful facilitation, right? It's actually, it's like, I've got to let go of where I think this woman needs to go, and I've got to be present with that woman's body and what I'm seeing. And like, what is the truth of the moment? Okay, what am I seeing that she might not be able to see, or what am I seeing in the. I can, like, pull on and, you know, like, pull on a thread and, okay, now we're over here and like, what's the truth of this moment now? And there is such a trust in that. There is such a trust in that, and it's so fucking stunning. I, you know, these are, these are the times in my work where I do feel most fulfilled when I'm in that space and I'm just like, I have no idea where this is going or what's gonna happen. I'm just like, here right now with this woman and her body, like it's so and I know you do the same with with men and the work you do, it's just like, so beautiful. It's so beautiful. I live for that shit. I live like that, that like that, the tension, the dynamic tension that comes online when you, like, got to be so fiercely present, because without that, the space crumbles, and it's like, Ah, this is, this is this is beautiful work to be doing, yeah, and someone feels that, like, I often use this. And there's so many crossovers with like facilitation and relationship, partnership and like the masculine and feminine. But I often talk about the word like, when the feminine feels dropped in partnership. So you know, if you say you're going to do something and you don't, or like, if I'm offering my heart and like, bringing myself so deeply, and then I see you get distracted, or like, pick up your phone, or that's the feeling of being dropped. And the same thing can happen in facilitation, right? So much so when a facilitator, you know, loses presence or is trying to like force something or like, and I know there's just not that attunement, some Yeah, they can, there can be a feeling of being dropped. Yeah, this went in a completely different direction than where I thought this conversation was gonna go. I want to circle back to like, the healing, the masculine healing, the relationship to the masculine. Like, where do you and I'm just gonna, I'm gonna put my little interview I had on to sort of start this conversation. I know you get a bit awkward when i That was one time you get a bit awkward. That was one time you get a bit weird. Like, I guess the like, what do you feel? What do you feel women are really craving from from that experience? Like, what like, for me, like, I want people to get, like, a kind of, like, a little peek behind the curtain, without too much as to what this because this process is fucking profound. I'm so grateful to get to be a part of it. But what do you feel women hours and hours and hours, it takes forever. Thanks for so stunning though. Yeah, make sure you eat beforehand. But, um, what do you feel like? The women are really like? What do you feel it creates like? What do you feel that women are really deeply, deeply getting from that experience? What is it, if you were to say, you know, what is it that they're, they're coming in and they've, I feel that every woman would be carrying something, yeah, it's a space, especially the the first part of that ceremony, which, you know, do we do we know, to express, okay, but the first part of the ceremony, which is really an opportunity for women to there's no, I'm just gonna Okay, I won't share like deeply, but like, it's, it's an opportunity for women to express their hurt, their hurt. How is the masculine hurt them, whether that's a man or, you know, you know men and so many women are carrying a carrying hurt in their body that has been unfelt and unexpressed, and to have a space, a safe space, you know, where they can move that in their body and liberate that in their body. And you know, if something isn't felt or expressed, it has nowhere to go, it sits in the body. And why this is such an important part of you know, relate, relating, and why I bring this experience into something like claimed, where it's women coming into a room because they want more from their relationship or a future partnership. It's because if we are holding pain and hurt and, yeah, pain and hurt in our body from a man that we've unfelt, that's gone unfelt and unexpressed, we are taking that body into our partnership, or our future partnership, and that is the way that we are navigating that partnership from through that hurt through the lens of that hurt through the lens of that. Continue. My love, sneaky, yeah, so it's so important that we as women like if we want the most potent, powerful, cracked the fuck open relationships possible, if we want that experience, we we need to liberate our body. We need to we need to get motherfucking angry for the shit that's happened. That's the biggest piece. I see with women, and I'm I really want to write a post around this, and maybe this is a whole other podcast episode. But so much of my work, like so much of my work with women, is teaching women that it makes me want to cry, like teaching women that it's okay to feel fucking angry. It's not even okay. It's important, like, it's so important that they get fucking angry about the shit that's happened instead of pushing it down or justifying it. I feel like they like, they reason with it. They create reasoning around it. Totally, yeah. And a lot of the time this happens with sexual abuse or sexual assault. And you know, majority of women have experienced some kind of sexual abuse or sexual assault, and a lot of those women are continuing in our society kind of conditions women to do this, to justify it or push it down. And it's so important if a woman desires to experience you know, whether it's a deep pleasure or deep love or deep feelings of safety with a man right in her relationship, that she actually goes through the process of letting herself feel fucking angry, letting herself say, that's not fucking okay, like, that's not fucking okay, and that, yeah, that's, that's a huge part of of what I what I do with women, teaching them, it's, it's, oh, it's important, it's necessary. They can't just go, I'm gonna push that down. And I want to get to the state of deep pleasure and ecstatic orgasms and epic relationship where I'm feeling claims like, No, that's a part of that journey. Like you being like, that was not fucking okay. And that's a huge part of that ceremony, letting women be in their motherfucking rage, letting women be in the depths of their grief, letting women be in the Yeah, in the pain, like let and letting that be there in the body, and letting them be witnessed, letting letting themselves be witnessed, in that so fucking powerful, so fucking liberating. And what becomes possible for a woman on this, on the other side of that, is like, I've got no words for that. Liberation. Liberation, anything is possible. Yeah, the other side of liberation, I think it's one of the key pieces that I feel in the space, is that they're all of the conditioning and all of the rules that maybe women have been handed to say, Hey, this is how you justify and get on with it. Yeah, all of that is taken and pushed to the side, pushed out of the space. We said, We don't do that here. We don't, yeah, that's, that's, you don't need to do that here. Yeah, whatever is there is whatever is sitting within you that you that you've had to hold on to because people told you it wasn't, wasn't right to be angry, it wasn't right to be frustrated. Wasn't right to to feel her, like, that's available, like that's welcome here, it's actually necessary for the for the rest of the process. Like, this is, and what I hear and that is, like, it's like actually creating space in the body for more of what you want, yeah. Like, whilst ever this stuff is sitting in there, it's there, it's taking up valuable space, and you, once through clearing that, you then get it to become a space for whatever it is that you do actually fucking want. Yeah, I think that's a I think that's such a beautiful, beautiful gift. And the thing that I would say about that. When it comes to a relationship, you can have a man that may want to love you really deeply, and he can be really good at holding presents and all these different things. But if you haven't, if you've got something that you're holding on to, there is a there's a level of responsibility, whether you're a man or a woman, to find a way to move that and dissolve that. And it can happen in your relationship, but if it's not happening in your relationship, you can go to places like claimed and actually feel the the support necessary to go into that thing, that emotion, that feeling, yeah, and move it, yeah. And for me, I think too, I just want to sort of explain why I believe that these spaces are, like, essential to, like, healthy relationships. And I've seen a lot of people talking about, like, you know, no level of personal development. Could it? Could, you know, prepare me for the depth of healing that I'd receive in my relationship. I'm like, Yeah, but it did, if you've done it like it does, but no, because everything that I've done outside of my relationship has allowed me to go deeper and heal and experience my relationship at a level that I never thought possible. And. Then there's the piece around. You could do all the fucking men's retreats and everything, but you've chosen to come back and integrate into the relationship. It's both. Yeah, it is both. But that piece there is like you have a responsibility to work on yourself, and sometimes you need to be away from like. You need to step into a space where there is a level of anonymity, or a level of like, Oh, there's more people here who can hold me, or there's relatability here, when you're with the sisters, or I'm with the brothers, and what I take from that, you know, some of the stuff I've had to, like process, especially the anger, like you that wasn't your responsibility to hold me in that, nor could you, because some of it has taken 10 to 15 guys to hold me in that really, like, that's true, that's not, that's not. I'm not. I'm not a strong I'm pretty strong. I'm not, like, that's not to say that I'm the strongest, but like, yeah, it's literally the the energy that was moving through me. It took that many guys to, like, be with me and hold that field of safety and non judgment. So that's why I believe this, this, like this whole weekend that you created, this whole retreat, this whole immersive experience for women, is it's fucking essential. Like, if women want deeper and loving relationships, you can create, you can come along to some of these and create depth and spaciousness in your body, and then know what it is that you want to fill it with. You become so much more capable. Amen. Wow. Did you another question? Give me one more. One more. Yeah. What do you feel women, like, like, there's a few things that I really, I really took notice of in the space. And I I saw, one of the things that I saw really clearly was exhaustion, women's exhaustion. And I'd love for you to just share what, what you saw like, what I really saw, the letting like. There was like some deep, deep moments of resting and surrendering for some of these women in the most beautiful way. And there was like, times where, yeah, all the women would be surrounding one woman, holding her and looking after her and almost like letting her know that she doesn't have to carry it all on her own, yeah, and that there's people here that can hold her. And that, for me, like after the that first part that you just spoke deeply into, I think it's like what these women get to like, almost anchor in their bodies. And like, Oh, this is what I want to feel. I want to feel like this. Like, how important do you feel like that is? And then like, like, bringing in your unique desires as to what you want as a woman, how, how important do you feel that is? How important do I feel? What is that feeling of like, getting to a point of surrender and opening. And then what do you do with that surrender and opening? How do you calibrate it to your lifestyle? Like, because every woman's different, yeah, and every woman has a different set of desires. But how do you like? One of the things I say is, like, if you crack yourself open and you create all of this space, unless you actually know what it is that you want, by default, if you go back out into the world, you'll just start filling it up unconsciously. Yeah, got you. I often, and I spoke this into the space. So many times it claimed, like I see an immersive experience as a way of, like creating a blueprint. And so many times I say this over and over again in like, all of our different playtime experiences, and you know, all of the experiences we had at that event, like, take a breath and let your body remember this moment. Like, take a breath and, like, create a blueprint of this moment. So it might be when a woman's in a surrendered state. It might be when she's like, ecstatically expressed, or like, alive in her expression, or like, has this desire on her heart and she's like, bringing it through. Or she's like, cracked open, so she's knowing the difference between, like, closure and opening. And, yeah, I'm such a huge advocate for like, going into an immersive space to have or, you know, I do this inside full spectrum woman too, on different calls. It's like, you know, remember this moment, like, create a blueprint, and then you practice that. Like, there's going to be moments where you forget that feeling and you you forget that, that posture, right? You forget you close, you contract, instead of the posture of opening. And your job outside of the room. So the women that claim to their job outside of the room is like, oh, when they notice themselves contracting, or, like, going back into patterns of emasculation, or, you know, why do I have to do it all myself? Or like, you know, trying to grip and hold and control and all these things. It's like, okay, my body knows what my body holds, the blueprint of surrender and openness and ecstasy and all of these things. How can I invite it back to that place right now? Sometimes it's a breath, if they're in partnership, sometimes it's walking back into the fucking room with their partner after they stormed out. Like but like inviting themselves back into that blueprint, knowing that their body knows that place, but they've got to consciously invite it back into. That place. And I think that's really important. After immersive experiences, retreats, big experience, anything this can be online as well. You do it. I say this every time I do a course, I'm like, please don't let this work stay in this month or this container. Like your job now is to practice this, to be a practitioner of this work. And the work doesn't work if you don't like to actually, yeah, you've got to be so conscious about, you know, practicing the posture, practicing the transmission, practicing that in the body. And you're 50% Yeah, I don't know if that answered your question, but no, that was exactly I love that, because I think that's like, for me, what I've had, and this is, like, I'm just speaking from a lot of guys that come to the gathering of men. They they have a good like, end of the year, we all gather in October, and then for a couple of months, the guys are firing on all cylinders. And then sort of the start of the year happens. Things start to sort of fall back into the old patterns. And then before they know, the guys like, Oh man, I just wish I could feel that again. I'm like, what you've said, there is what I'm gonna actually bring into the gatherings. Like brothers. Take a moment to like, anchor this as a blueprint in your body. Like, feel this moment when you step into the center and you speak. Feel This Moment. Feel it and anchor it in your body as memory, as as like, as as like, anchor it into the marrow of your bones. Yeah, and I love what you said. You answered. It was like, Oh, how do women like, you know, keep this space open. They number one is that they anchor it as a blueprint in their body, this feeling of liberation or surrender or deep relaxation. And then we continue to do the work after the the immersion, after the month after the workshop. Yeah, that's such a beautiful thing to to be with. I think that is such an important piece. And you know, our teacher, gem, we should always say, own your 50% which is really around like the practice, can only ever meet you as deeply as you meet the practice, right? It's not going to do the work for you. You have to continue to meet it and sit with it and relate to it and deepen with it. And I think that's something that that you and I are really passionate about, whether it's in our work, in our relationship with our family, with our friends, we're constantly seeing where it is that we're closing, or where it is that we can deepen in the into the practice of, like, giving our heart, yeah, and doing that in the in a responsible and appropriate way. Yeah, I just had an analogy come in as well, because, well, I'm teaching the pleasure portal at the moment, so it's orgasms and self pleasure is on my mind. Perfect. I also really teach this around, like when a woman is in the practice of self pleasure, like I often say, how we fuck is how we do life, and whether it's fucking ourselves or fucking someone else, it's like how we show up in those moments. So if we're self pleasuring and we're just like, oh my god, I'm gonna climb on a climax. I want to climax. I want to like, we're just like, focusing on the goal. We're like as women so often, and in men, when orgasm is coming or ejaculation is coming, it's like tensing. It's like trying to push it out. It's like gripping, controlling. And so if we look at that in terms of, like, how we fuck is how we do life, it's like, okay, where are we gripping, controlling, tensing, forcing, like, trying to, like, chase something. And so this blueprint piece can be really beautiful, like practicing self pleasure and moving towards orgasm, or just pleasure in the body, and letting go of the goal and really relax, like really intentionally relaxing and surrendering into pleasure, because that's where the deepest orgasms live from in the place. And like, relaxing into them, surrendering into them. And then I like to, and I've done this in my own body so many times, and I teach women like, like, remember that place, like, when you're surrendering, when you're releasing, the grit, when orgasm is moving through you from a surrendered, relaxed space, like, create a motherfucking blueprint in your body for that. So the next time you're in a launch, in your business and you're wanting to grip and Chase, you're like, oh, okay, I know that shape, I know that posture. I know that feeling of, like, relaxing into what I want. Okay, can I, like, invite my body into that state now, as I'm, you know, in a launch, or as I'm moving towards something like that, same blueprint is so important then out in the world. So, yeah, I just wanted to add that I love that. Yeah, I love that. Okay, anything else we want to bring? Is there anything else that you want to share about healing the masculine or like, what are you like? Is there anything else? Yeah, just that. It was such a profound experience those three days at clean and I will be doing many, many, many more. I might even create a wait list for this episode. So your wait list maybe, maybe go to the go to the show notes. There's probably going to be a wait list there. So you can add yourself to the wait list. Because most, not, most likely, I will definitely be doing more claimed immersions and. Different immersions next year feels really, really important. What else was I going to say? Then doors to full spectrum woman are opening soon. So if you are, even if you're close by, but if, if coming to an in person immersion isn't for you, my membership is the place where it's at so many new women already stepped inside in the last week or two, through these back door access passes that we've been we've been offering through different things. But shout out to the women that are jumping in like all in. Oh my god, it's so fun. I think this is going to be the biggest fucking launch yet for full spectrum woman. So keep an eye out doors are gonna open next week, depending on when this Yeah, next week. So late. What day does it early? Early August. Keep an eye on my Instagram and mailing list. Yeah, really fucking excited for that. Fuck yeah. I want to just like, like, really, just like, anchor into and honor You My Love, and celebrate the body of work that you've developed over many years, but the claimed immersion really feels like you've, you've you've anchored in like an initiatory almost a rite of passage for women to remember who the fuck they are. Thank you. Create space for everything that they deeply desire and like feel the true feelings that are there that they may not have had access to in healthy ways in the past. So this is, like, such an initiatory, beautiful, beautiful way for women to come together and and anchor in these feelings, and then to then have access to full spectrum woman for, like, a 12 month journey to come and like, do the work to keep in in the space and stay in the sisterhood, and do the practices and learn more and almost build the muscle of of feminine expression and this full spectrum woman lifestyle, like, to me, it feels like you're you're this body of work is starting to almost just like land in it, in a really beautiful, healthy ecosystem where, like, you can come and do claim and then spend 12 months deepening with all the incredible like master classes and All the other facilitators and teachers that you have come in. It's a, yeah, I can see how this is going to be, you know, this is, this is just this start of the devotion to, you know, many, many years of beautiful, beautiful work with women who are ready to deepen into their the core of who they are. And I'm excited to play a part in it. Really, really excited to play a part in it. And I'm so grateful to you for Yeah, all the work you do. And coming into claimed that was yeah, no words for that experience. I just want to say one more thing to like I had a had a guy reach out his partner came to claimed, and he spoke about how beautiful it was to receive her back into the world, back into the relationship. And not only that, but how it, you know, opened up a whole, a whole other place of transformation for him, in something he'd been going through as well he didn't share. But you said, man, like having her come back so open and, and, and it actually took me on, on my own path that, you know, led to a deep transformation. And he just said, yeah, you just want to honor the ripple of this work. And I think that's something that's so beautiful, is that when we do this work for ourselves, it positively influences others. It impacts others in a beautiful way. So for any women that are doing this work, thank you so much. For any women that are finding their way to full spectrum. Woman, thank you for walking the path and yeah, so grateful, so honored, and so much love, so much love. Thanks for tuning in. We'll see you again next week. See you again next week. Thanks for sticking with us through all of the technical, aka Django difficulties at the start. But we love you guys, thanks for listening. I love you. Bye poo.