Ep 62: Anger and Emotional Expression in a Relationship

How do you embrace and navigate the raw power of emotions in your relationship, especially anger?

This episode is a deep dive into the essence of true emotional intimacy, showcasing the importance of creating a safe space where every emotion is welcomed without judgment. Meg and Jacob talked about the art of expressing feelings without projection and the transformative impact of fully embracing each other's emotional spectrum.

If you want to build a relationship that thrives on authenticity, vulnerability, and mutual respect, allowing you both to grow and connect on profound levels, this episode is a must for you.

We also riffed off on:

• Embracing anger and wholeness in identity.
• The pivotal role of responsibility and humility in business growth.
• The transformative power of addressing "unsexy" tasks like taxes for long-term success.
• Celebrating memorable moments of connection and engagement at personal events.
• Exploring intimacy through playful and humorous experiences with chocolate and blindfolds.
• Navigating the dynamics of nudism, relationships, and personal comfort zones.
• The importance of cleanly expressing emotions in relationships to deepen intimacy.
• Recognizing the necessity of emotional expression and the right to take up space within a partnership.

And many more!

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Transcript

Meg O'Neill: 0:00

Through embracing and owning my full fucking spectrum that I meet my wholeness and I come into the full aliveness and full power that's, you know, available to me as woman. And so that meant no longer pushing down my anger no longer saying, I'm not an angry person. I don't get angry. I've surpassed that emotion it was. Can I be the woman that allows anger to take up space in her body? Can I allow anger to take up space in my body and not make that mean? I'm not spiritual not make that mean. I'm not a good woman. Not make that mean anything about myself? Can I just let that energy be present in my body? Can I let that expression be alive in me?

Jacob O'Neill: 0:53

Yo, yo, yo lovers, welcome. Welcome. Welcome to sex, love and everything in between where the O'Neill's you're here with Meg and Jacob. And

Meg O'Neill: 1:01

this is the place we have really uncensored conversations about sex, intimacy and relationships. We're super excited. You're here. Enjoy this episode.

Jacob O'Neill: 1:21

Yo, yo, lovers. Hi. Hi,

Meg O'Neill: 1:23

beautiful humans.

Jacob O'Neill: 1:24

How are you? My love?

Meg O'Neill: 1:25

I am great.

Jacob O'Neill: 1:27

Today's a good day.

Meg O'Neill: 1:27

I'm feeling a little tired. But

Jacob O'Neill: 1:32

life is good. All in all.

Meg O'Neill: 1:34

Yeah, I just had to I just had a 90 minute chat to the tax department. Yeah, how'd that go? It was amazing. I love really beautiful conversation with a woman on the phone. Because he was really supportive. And I was just saying that like, getting usually though, like I was on hold for 45 minutes or like waiting to, you know, get on the phone for 45 minutes, and then actually chatting to her for 45 minutes. And sometimes I would be a real victim after those kind of conversation that that was hard. And that took so long. You're

Jacob O'Neill: 2:07

really putting on your big girl pants and doing things aren't you? I

Meg O'Neill: 2:11

am doing the hard things lately.

Unknown: 2:13

Yeah, you've without complaining about them? Yeah, you're doing a very good job of that. Thank you.

Jacob O'Neill: 2:19

It's been a big ride.

Meg O'Neill: 2:21

It's been challenging things happening.

Jacob O'Neill: 2:24

I think it's so hard when you've had success to a degree like you've had a certain level of success. And then you go through like a less expansive period, it's not necessarily worse, it's just that you're no longer expanding or things aren't as amplified as they used to be. And then you've got it actually, like, structurally make sure everything's structurally sound to continue to the next step. I

Meg O'Neill: 2:48

think that's business. Like, I think I was in a really immature stage of my business when I had all of that rapid growth.

Unknown: 2:56

Yeah. And

Meg O'Neill: 2:58

I have been known for brought back down to earth but just really realizing that be if you want to create a sustainable business and a long term business that takes like, such a depth of responsibility. Yeah. And I think for the first part of my business, when I had big growth, I wasn't really didn't have a great relationship with the responsibility. And now I'm

Unknown: 3:23

now I'm healing that. Totally

Meg O'Neill: 3:26

calling the tax department and doing other things. Yeah,

Jacob O'Neill: 3:30

it takes a it takes a level of humility as well. I believe, like, it's so easy to sweep those things under the rug and be like, I'm not looking at that I'm just focusing on growth expanding your ego. And for me, that's been a big one of the biggest humbling is like actually talking to the accountant actually doing all the things that I need to do actually making sure it's all balanced and that my payment plan with the ATO is fucking organized, and it's all just, it's all just, to me, it's the most boring shit, but it's like, that's the like, once again, it's kind of like what we speak about with relationships. You know, sometimes the things that make you feel the most free are the things that are not that much that don't feel that freeing. With relationships, sometimes the best sex comes from doing the most unsexy things

Unknown: 4:12

agreed. Okay, grade.

Jacob O'Neill: 4:15

So yeah, ATO shadow. Well,

Meg O'Neill: 4:18

I don't actually even know in a shout out

Jacob O'Neill: 4:21

to the mysterious one. The beautiful lady at the ATO,

Meg O'Neill: 4:25

beautiful lady. And for those listening, go into the thing you've been avoiding. If you're in business, especially going to the thing you've been avoiding in your business, go yes. Go do it now. Even pause this podcast and go and do it. And then come back and you'll be liberated as you listen. And this

Jacob O'Neill: 4:41

will land so much more deeper.

Unknown: 4:43

Yes.

Jacob O'Neill: 4:45

Liberate yourself. What are we talking about today? My love? Well, we

Meg O'Neill: 4:49

had a podcast party on the weekend.

Jacob O'Neill: 4:51

I look at the camera show. Look

Unknown: 4:52

at you. I would prefer your eyes. Okay.

Jacob O'Neill: 4:55

Is it gonna look a little bit crazy? I'm just staring down the camera and

Meg O'Neill: 4:57

I'm just looking at you. We have Podcast party on the weekend.

Jacob O'Neill: 5:01

We did. How's it go? So

Meg O'Neill: 5:02

much? Fucking fun. Yeah, so much fucking fun. It went unbelievably well,

Jacob O'Neill: 5:07

you had an awesome crew rockin.

Meg O'Neill: 5:09

I just had a meeting with our business manager earlier. And she was like, did you guys employ an event planner? No.

Unknown: 5:19

That looked legit.

Meg O'Neill: 5:22

She was like, someone did someone else do that? was like, No, that was all us. It was all us. It was all us. It felt so fun. You know, you do a lot more live events and things than me. But yours are mainly on the land. Yeah, and very

Jacob O'Neill: 5:39

pretty monitor. These ones this was

Meg O'Neill: 5:42

yeah, this was very aesthetically beautiful in the space and all the things and yeah, I'm so fucking proud of what we created. And and the humans there the community that arrived in the space. We're just so great and so engaged and it was so much fun. It was an epic dance floor. Yeah. was such a good night.

Jacob O'Neill: 6:00

What was your favorite? were three of your favorite moments.

Meg O'Neill: 6:04

Three of my favorite moments, I loved the dance floor at the beginning of the night.

Jacob O'Neill: 6:08

Yeah, peach DJ, dance barn bakes that. Go Coast throw

Meg O'Neill: 6:13

up peaches and cream and some of us were like spraying create the whipped cream onto the peaches and like licking it off. That was really fun. I would

Jacob O'Neill: 6:22

like to lick whipped cream off your page.

Meg O'Neill: 6:27

Would you actually yes. Do you actually like whipped cream? I had the tiniest bit because I was like, I don't like dairy and

Jacob O'Neill: 6:36

everyone loves dairy and sugar. That's just a limiting belief that you have.

Meg O'Neill: 6:40

Which I've never heard that

Jacob O'Neill: 6:43

desire to like you're hearing it now.

Meg O'Neill: 6:45

Okay, well, when I go out this afternoon, what if I come home with a can of whipped cream?

Unknown: 6:50

I'm gonna lick it off your Pete

Jacob O'Neill: 6:56

Okay, that was one. What's the next which?

Meg O'Neill: 6:59

Side? Can we just say? Do you know what I'm gonna say? No.

Unknown: 7:03

What story? The story? Yeah.

Meg O'Neill: 7:08

Cry loving. And I don't even remember the details that much of this. But it was probably three

Unknown: 7:13

or four years ago now. And what did I ask

Jacob O'Neill: 7:16

for this? No, I was just leaning in to the relationship in a way that I never had done before. And Jacob

Meg O'Neill: 7:22

brought chocolate into the bedroom. Melted chocolate. So you've melted it? Yeah. So you went and put it on like the stove and melted it?

Jacob O'Neill: 7:30

I assume so. I

Unknown: 7:31

can't exactly remember that. So and then you brought it in? And then you were like putting it all over me? Yeah. Now are you looking at off? Yeah,

Meg O'Neill: 7:42

there was just a point where it's like, I think you have more than you started laughing and then it just looked like shit. Funny, and I was just like, This is not sexy at all.

Jacob O'Neill: 7:54

made on your on your page that I see it at all. Like you're posting notes just like it looked like gross.

Unknown: 7:59

Literally shit on me.

Jacob O'Neill: 8:03

It wasn't as sexy as I thought it was gonna be. I enjoyed licking the chocolate off like it tasted good, but it just looked. It didn't look good.

Unknown: 8:11

But then you were also kind of laughing and like it was just like, yeah, it didn't feel.

Jacob O'Neill: 8:16

I wouldn't say that. Yeah, it didn't feel like I was really penetrating you with my presence and my deep passion. It was more me giggling like a little boy. It was crazy. Yeah. So I asked to stop. You did and then you had to go and wash off.

Unknown: 8:30

Wash the chocolate chips off me. Yeah, I do. Like remember that time I like fat. I blindfolded you and like I was just the computer. I fed you different things. That was fun.

Jacob O'Neill: 8:45

Yeah. A bit funny about central eating. But um, I remember that being being fun. Yeah.

Unknown: 8:54

Yeah, you're a bit funny about relinquishing

Meg O'Neill: 8:57

control. Yes. That's what you're finding it. It's just leaving it someone feeding you. Come on

Jacob O'Neill: 9:05

to this podcast we theropods. Today I came on here to talk about a completely different topic that we haven't even got to yet. So

Meg O'Neill: 9:10

this has been any other food related? Sex stories we want to bring in? No, I

Jacob O'Neill: 9:19

remember. When we did naked yoga, we had to feed stories to each other. I remember that being quite a fun shout out

Meg O'Neill: 9:25

to Rosie race. Yeah. So Rosie Reese, founder of Yanni pleasure palace, maybe six months into our relationship. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz it would have been six months. I heard about this naked yoga class that Rosie was running. And I invited Jacob, and we went in Brisbane. And that was, that would have been a route did that feel like a real edge for you? Yeah, massively even remembering back to I thought that was quite bold of me to invite you. Yeah,

Jacob O'Neill: 9:56

it was very like, it was I was just really into By then I was like, Yeah, this is cool. It was really hot. Yeah, it was really sexy. Yeah. What do you reckon? Should we do it again? Yeah, we should What were you thinking? Thinking

Meg O'Neill: 10:13

of? Like the other people like sometimes you would be there was one movie phased out we cat coward. Yeah, and you were cat counting. I think you were looking at like, been lives pussy and butthole but I was looking at someone else I want to look at my man. Not not man.

Jacob O'Neill: 10:35

I just remember that there was one guy one couple there that they were the they were the high achievers when it came to nude. nudist nude history. Yes. nudism and he was actually sharing how he was. He managed many different Facebook groups, Facebook groups for the nudists, nudists of North Brisbane gardening nudist enthusiast all of these different Facebook groups and I was just like, I don't he was very, very vocal about his his new display lifestyle. He

Meg O'Neill: 11:10

wanted it to be very known that this was a normal night for him. I'm not meaning any edges. This is normal for me. This is a regular Tuesday night

Jacob O'Neill: 11:18

this year. I'd be doing this anyway. Yeah, yeah. Well, talk Mark see you brother. This is very new to me.

Meg O'Neill: 11:31

Okay, well back to the podcast body. Yeah. So your three Did I did I

Jacob O'Neill: 11:36

get one? Yep. Um

Meg O'Neill: 11:41

What else loved the sex panel? Yeah,

Jacob O'Neill: 11:44

that was awesome with you, Lola and Eleanor. Love it that so

Meg O'Neill: 11:48

much. And also, I was I just loved how engaged everyone was with with the questions. Last epic questions people were really engaging in the conversation is just incredible. And I loved this the fourth one, but I also just loved meeting our community and meeting people that you know, I connected with online, but never got to meet in the flesh or meeting brand new people that I had no idea, you know, listen to the podcast or where we're coming. So that was it was just so beautiful to be in the flesh. I want to do in person events all the time. Now.

Unknown: 12:22

Don't think that before an event, it's a lot of work for an event. I'm like, fuck this.

Jacob O'Neill: 12:28

It's a lot of work to do. But it always when when you pull it off the way that we did, like, it was another sort of moment of like, oh, this is awesome. We've, we've brought people together. We've had great conversations. We've served really beautifully here. And I yeah, I like to think of like, it doesn't matter. What I make out of it, or what success I deem is like, was was I've service and did this, you know, support people in? In creating better relationships, deeper moments of truth. I was like, Fuck, yeah. I love the food. Food was great. The food was incredible. I loved the love, just like everyone walking and everyone was so everyone was dressed so nice and stylish and sexy as hell. So good to see everyone just like rolling in. It was like really nice to see that everyone had like, rocked up just yet well dressed. There's so many good outfits. And then the third one was I really loved. What else did I love? I really loved the final q&a section for us. That was Mike. I really enjoyed that. That was one of my favorite bits. I really enjoyed the back and forth. Yeah, and shout out to you guys on the second panelist some really hilarious and just awesome moments of and it was cool to see three women who are in an industry doing similar yet uniquely different things all speak so powerfully on specific topics or specific questions that have such a passionate and certain answer for that question from three different points of view. And it was really great to hear you lower Eleanor speak on those things. Yeah.

Meg O'Neill: 14:05

You guys listening are all going to get access to the recordings. We're going to drop that in probably two weeks time. Yeah, we got in a couple of weeks and have three different kinds of one plus

Jacob O'Neill: 14:15

two plus three. Yeah. So

Unknown: 14:16

watch, watch. Watch, watch. Watch this space. Yes. Anyway, anyway, we

Meg O'Neill: 14:24

had so we had this final q&a on Saturday night, and we didn't get time to answer all the questions can are a lot of questions. And one of our dear friends came up to us at the end. And, you know, asked a question that that he had, and we're actually going to devote the rest of the podcast to answering this because it's a great motherfucking question.

Jacob O'Neill: 14:41

Such a great question and very relevant

Meg O'Neill: 14:45

to before the podcast because you were feeling angry of eight

Jacob O'Neill: 14:49

is very relevant. Not right not to ask right now, but it's a relevant question for relationships. Yeah,

Unknown: 14:54

totally. You weren't feeling angry me?

Jacob O'Neill: 14:57

I was feeling angry. Yes.

Unknown: 14:58

Let's bring it to the mind. I can take this Kenny,

Jacob O'Neill: 15:02

you weren't listening to what I was telling you. You weren't obeying my rule. Can you please stop?

Meg O'Neill: 15:08

Okay, what was what was the question? The question was

Jacob O'Neill: 15:12

around bringing your anger into your or your rage or your expression of that into your relationship? And how do you how do you do that? As a man? How do you do that as a woman? And what are the positive and negative effects of that? And what are the different ways in which you bring it? And can that be the difference between positive and negative? That's a sort of extrapolated version of the question. But yeah, the essence was, how do you you know, what do you do when you're feeling rage and you want to bring it to your relationship or you want it you want it to be seen whilst you're in, in proximity to your partner? Yeah,

Meg O'Neill: 15:42

and I think you know, we speak especially in my work I speak a lot about being fully expressed in relationship and revealing to your partner and bringing the truth. And I think this is such a beautiful topic we get to dive into to bring the nuances to that because it's very different to cleanly bring your rage and anger which means without projection, versus uncleanly to Italy, Italy uncleanly bring your rage and anger which is more like projecting that onto your partner on to the person in the space.

Unknown: 16:21

Yes, yeah.

Meg O'Neill: 16:25

When when our friend asked us this question, I had a story come up immediately around. I think it was probably seven years ago now is very early on in our relationship or a few years in and this was when in my art I was in my spiritual bypass, he kind of veer off.

Jacob O'Neill: 16:41

I don't want you to, I don't want you to call it that. I think you're just in your puppy dog stage. Oh, you went by passing Okay, let's not talk about that timing of your life is bypassing because you definitely weren't bypassing okay, you just hadn't descended into your dark like the darkness yet into your body deeply into your body. Don't Don't say that. Which is bypassing it's not no because you didn't it would be bypassing if you knew you totally you hadn't yet and we were still very early on in our journey. So I think that you're exactly where you're at you went bypass and you're at the stage you're at if you are still operating like that now. Yeah, and I will not I will not let you speak ill of her. Because she is a massive part of you and she is what got you here so I will not I will not

Meg O'Neill: 17:24

have that I love you. Okay, I was in my puppy dog stages spirituality, you love and light. I was very lucky. I was in my love and light era. Yeah, I was very much Abraham Hicks, your thoughts create your reality. Get in the vortex manifestation

Jacob O'Neill: 17:42

manifest.

Meg O'Neill: 17:43

And my my, my beliefs were stay high vibe. And that's the way to get what you want. So anger, sadness, grief, any of these emotions I saw as like low vibrational emotions. And if I was to play in that area, they weren't serving me and what I wanted. Right, I thought it I truly believed like this was my belief system back then. That anyone that was expressing anger wasn't as spiritually evolved as me. Yes, I used to look at people that were expressing anger and just be like, you're not quite there yet.

Jacob O'Neill: 18:22

Did you have those exact thoughts? Yes. Totally. Okay,

Meg O'Neill: 18:25

I felt better than people angry people.

Unknown: 18:29

I truly did. Do you not think I would have

Jacob O'Neill: 18:32

no I just think it's like, yeah, you you think oh, anger is like such a low vibrational? Yeah. Energy

Meg O'Neill: 18:38

and I would have just been like, yeah, do some yoga and meditation and you need to, you need to find the spiritual path and then and then you won't ever get angry, gentle, gentle and you'll just never get angry and you'll never be angry at anything. I don't get angry have I've supposed the emotion of anger. I have risen. So that was that was where I was playing. Yeah. And we were driving somewhere and we just pulled up at a friend's place. You know, you and I in the car and you had this big smoothie. And as we pulled up you knocked the smoothie. And the smoothie went all over the car. And for those of you that don't know Jacob loves cleanliness. Jacob loves

Unknown: 19:20

friendliness.

Jacob O'Neill: 19:22

I'm just just remembering this moment it makes me still

Meg O'Neill: 19:26

you you still yeah whenever you whenever you drop something on mess up something your lead that's when you're hardest on yourself. Yes.

Jacob O'Neill: 19:38

So I dropped this mean drop

Meg O'Neill: 19:39

this movie. And you think you just like huffed like you were just like, Ah, I

Jacob O'Neill: 19:46

went fucking a punch of staring real hard. Stealing real steering wheel really hard.

Meg O'Neill: 19:53

Okay, yeah, you punch the wheel and then what did you say? Fuck yeah, and I think I just like froze a little I just sat there. And I don't remember if we had a conversation but what I do remember is like, believing that expression was wrong. You expressing in that way was wrong. And that you could have just been like, Oh, I dropped my smoothie. Bomb. Ah, yeah. Everything's always working out.

Jacob O'Neill: 20:24

Yeah, that was not gonna happen. And

Meg O'Neill: 20:26

so I don't remember the conversation, but I remember making you feel wrong for that. Yes. I remember making you feel like you shouldn't have done that. And that was Yeah, almost you should have felt ashamed for for expressing the anger. Do you want to share anything about that? That experience at all?

Jacob O'Neill: 20:46

Yeah. No, I just really feel it. Yeah. Like I remember you hopping out of the car and having to like, I need to hop out of the car. I need to get away from this. Yeah. And as soon as you do that, I felt like fuck, what have I done? Yeah, I'm not allowed to be like this. And that's my biggest wound is not allowed to be loud and assertive and aggressive and take up space. Yeah. And yeah, that felt it felt like the smoothie we all through the car was really fucking bad. But then that feeling of like, you're not like not really feeling safe, somewhat around that was like, that sucked even more. Yeah, yeah. And I want to, I hadn't really shown any of that to you either. That's the other thing is like, I've never really brought that into our relationship. So it wasn't like, I was doing it regularly. But it was like that was very out of character for me. Yeah, and that. That really was like, a moment in time. And then I was like, okay, don't do that again. And then I wanted to rein that in, hide that part of me again.

Meg O'Neill: 21:54

Yeah, and then, for me, I just want to take this from my perspective to begin with, and I'd love to hear your thoughts for me then in the next few years, that's when I really took that descent into my body. And I you know, how to had a huge feminine awakening and sexual awakening and really, you know, moved out of my love and light era and began to realize that it was through embracing and owning my full fucking spectrum that I meet my wholeness and I come into the full aliveness and full power that's you know, available to me as woman and so that meant no longer pushing down my anger no longer saying I'm not an angry person. I don't get angry. I've surpassed that emotion it was can I be the woman that allows anger to take up space in her body? Can I allow anger to take up space in my body and not make that mean? I'm not spiritual not make that mean? I'm not a good woman. Not make that mean anything about myself? Can I just let that energy be present in my body? Can I let that expression be alive in me? And I began to realize like that's the fucking feminine right? She doesn't give a fuck what she feels she just wants to feel right she's not just hanging out in love and light she's like, Give me it all. Like let me taste all the bucking flavors and find myself in each of them.

Jacob O'Neill: 23:23

That's definitely the dark feminine for sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that that like volcanic like thunderstorm tidal wave like, like the you know, walking along the path of like total annihilation and credible nourishment. Like I often think of like the monsoonal season in barley and it's like, this is so hectic, all of this fucking rain. But then once it clears, it's like the place is just vibrant and life giving and all the fruits and all of the just like gives back is back is back. And that to me is kind of like what I felt like the descent or the Awakening was for us, like deepening into this this this this this part of the feminine and then from that the fruits of your loins No, no, I don't know where I was going with that. But yeah, there was it for fruit. It was very good

Meg O'Neill: 24:21

um, yeah, I feel like something I always say is like when a woman cages of any part of herself, she cages up her power. That was my experience. It was like, Oh, I've made anger wrong within myself. But in doing that, I'm actually caging up a part of myself which is a part of my power. And so I really began the journey of just allowing not only anger and rage but other emotions that I'd made wrong or I was ashamed over I didn't think was spiritual. Like, I I allowed that them to take up space in my body. I practice being a woman that felt them and express them. And that was fucking huge in my own body, but how that rippled out is suddenly I wasn't triggered by your expression when you brought that. Yeah. And suddenly it wasn't. Oh my gosh, how dare he? How dare he bring that? That's wrong. It was I can. He's allowed to express that.

Jacob O'Neill: 25:23

This is welcome here.

Meg O'Neill: 25:24

This is this is welcome. I don't even need to have an opinion on this. You can, and you do. So even even packing the trailer for Saturday, I think something happened and you were like, you just yelled really loudly, like FOC or something like that. And I'm just just like, oh, like that's, that's just you in expression. You're not throwing that at me. You're not saying that at me. You're just letting that's a way you let that energy take up space in your body. And it's actually I'm so grateful. You're a man that does that, because you're liberating yourself. You know, you're not a man that gets stuck in that emotion. But you, you let that be an expression and you move through that.

Jacob O'Neill: 26:08

That's the and I think it's so important. You spoke about the clean and the unclean, or that God and that for me is like the difference as we cultivate a relationship with our our lifeforce, which can be seen as anger, or rage or whatever. But as we cultivate our relationship with the emotion of anger, we learn to express it in a healthy way and not project it, which is an unhealthy expression. Yeah, so we're pointing the finger and with we're using it to attack another human rather, it's just an expression. It's just literally a sound and, and a feeling and a movement that comes through our body.

Meg O'Neill: 26:45

And when we, in partnership can, you know, it starts off in our own bodies, we need to build a relationship with that part of ourselves, we need to give ourselves permission to be able to express and feel anger and rage in that part of us, in order to be able to welcome it in another and that can be fucking huge, especially if you have grown up in a household where anger was expressed very uncleanly. Right. And very volcanically, and very, you know, very unsafely reactive,

Jacob O'Neill: 27:24

like, there's someone in your family who is very reactive. And would you would take things personally and then use anger to attack or to try and win against, you know, whether it was your mother or to your father? Or was it whether it was one of your parents to you and your siblings, or one of your siblings to you, if there's someone that's reactive and uses anger as a, as a way to win by projecting it all over the place, then yeah, you're not going to feel very, it's very likely that you're not going to feel comfortable in your own anger, let alone anger with anyone else.

Meg O'Neill: 27:54

And this can take some time to unravel those stories and unravel that imprint. To be able to build a relationship with anger, that's, that's a different texture, right? It's not this unclean anger that's used as a weapon, or used as a projection, but it's just the texture. It's the energy, it's the clean energy of anger, that just wants to be expressed and embodied. Yes. And so that's what we're really speaking about here. And we'll speak about the difference more, I'm sure. But that is fucking powerful when we learn to bring our anger cleanly into our relationship, which to me just simply means feeling it and being witnessed feeling it, right, not trying to throw it at our partner and be like, I'm feeling this way because of you. Not trying to grab that anger out of our body and push it on to our partner. So they feel it and we can get rid of it in our body. Right? But actually, just like, ah, like, I might say to you, like, Ah, this anger here on my body, like anger alive here on my body. I'm feeling this like Final rage here in my body. And it's not, fuck you. I'm really fucking angry at you. It's, ah, like, there's this this texture, there is this expression here that wants to be felt and I'm going to allow you to witness me in what's alive.

Jacob O'Neill: 29:19

Totally. That's exactly how I feel. I feel that's the difference between projection and expression. It's like it's awareness. And it's like, I can be aware of what's this is why it's so important to take that descent like come down and actually live in the body. Because when you are living in the body, you become aware of your feelings before they start to come out of you. And this is the the work is like actually creating enough sensitivity and awareness to be like, Oh, I am feeling angry right now. Oh, there's anger here. Ah, and this is the piece like you. If you're bringing that to your partner. I'm feeling angry. or there's anger here right now for me, then you have a responsibility to deep like to inquire deeper into it. And if you want to do that with your partner, you can if they're curious and they're wanting to ask and take it, take it deeper than you have, if you're gonna bring that awareness and just say that you have a responsibility to then deepen into it, and inquire with it and move it. If you bring like I'm feeling angry, and then you just walk away or you use it as a way to kind of like, manipulate your partner. Yeah, all this anger here right now for me. And then you like, kind of use it as a way to manipulate and sort of like, have them like, Well, shit, I don't know, what am I meant to do something about that? Are you What's you use it to confuse that's not, that's still using your anger in a in an unhealthy way. But if you come to your partner with the intention of clearing it, and sharing it with like, sharing what you're moving through, then that's that's the piece here that we're talking about, like conscious, consciously bringing it to your partner, and then finding a way to express it and move it in a healthy way. Yeah.

Meg O'Neill: 31:08

And even I'm thinking of, you know, moments where? And again, I don't know if we're kind of skipping too far forward here. Is there anything else you want to bring? No, I was just gonna talk about smashing plates.

Jacob O'Neill: 31:19

Again, talk about that.

Meg O'Neill: 31:22

Even like, in moments where, you know, we've really, we're both very comfortable with each other's anger now, and again, this is an anger we're projecting onto each other. And just to clarify, when we talk about projection, it's really you're feeling anger, and you want to blame your partner for that anger. You want them to change something about what they're doing in their life, so that anger can go away. But really, that anger is there in your body for you to feel and you to express and you to embody. And yes, that anger can point towards, like, anger is such a powerful fucking emotion because it points us towards what we motherfucking care about. When we're angry, it is guiding us back to what we care about what's really fucking important to us what we really deeply value. And so it's our responsibility. When we are feeling anger, to feel it, it's your partner, no matter what they change in their life, they can't jump into your body and express and and embody and move that energy for you. That's you, that's on you. And then your job can be okay, what is this pointing me back to what information is here that I can actually bring to my partner? Ah, there's anger here. Like you said, you were going to, you know, be off your call at 4pm. So we could hang out, and now it's six, and I was making dinner and I was just feeling this rage in my body. Right? And then that can guide back towards okay, what's what do I care about? Why am I angry? Oh, I care about you keeping your word, or I care about quality time together. Right, and they get to be this information instead of just this huge blow up and this blame? Yeah,

Jacob O'Neill: 33:10

it's an access point, right? Yeah. It's like, what is this? What is this wanting to tell me? Rather than how can I put this on. And that's the beautiful thing is like, I'm feeling angry. And let me talk into a little more about, you know, where that anger may be coming from. And then what it is that I'm actually not getting, that I'm desiring. And that's the, you know, we talk about you talk about this, like, beneath every complaint, there's a desire, and this is a healthy way to like own feelings, acknowledge what's happened, and then deepen into what the truth of the desire is. Yeah. And that's a beautiful, you know, it's not about getting it perfect every time either. But it's about having the framework so you know, kind of where you might be stumbling off course. And we're not perfect at this by any means. And I don't think anyone is but like, when you start to feel that anger come through, or you start to maybe, yeah, throw a grenade or stick a knife in the side and try to like, try to manipulate your partner and sort of win the the argument or when the moment it's like, oh, hang on. Let me actually take a breath and breathe into this anger and ask it what is it here? What is it here? And why is it trying to tell me something?

Meg O'Neill: 34:18

I love that. And I think I think that and correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think we ever say I'm angry at you. I don't think that's ever language we really use. It's more than I am feeling anger.

Jacob O'Neill: 34:33

Yeah, I would say like I would. Yeah, we'd say I'm feeling this and, or I'm, I'm feeling upset. And it's you know, and when you when you did this, we we never we never say you made me feel, Oh, I'm angry. I'm angry at you as like, I'm feeling angry. I was really looking forward to this thing that you said you would do or this thing that we were doing and it's not happening. Yeah, I'm feeling angry. Yeah.

Meg O'Neill: 35:01

And I think that deep ownership of our emotions is really the doorway to be able to cleanly express these emotions instead of projecting. Right? Because language is important. Sometimes we say that words don't really matter. And it's more the energy behind it. And yes, there's truth to that. But also, this can change the energetics title, and we start to no longer use the words, I'm angry at you, you did this to me. And we start saying, oh, there's, there's anger here on my body. I'm feeling a rage right now. There's an ownership to that. And yes, we can still bring it to our partner. And yes, we can still share what upset us or what particular action created the feeling in our body. But it's not giving them complete responsibility and blame for the emotion that arose in our body. Oh, and again, you know, something we talk about on the podcast, so much is moving from, you know, this win lose dynamic, you know, we're on where each other's opponents to actually being on the same team and seeing that our goal is deeper intimacy. And in these moments, it's so important to do that.

Unknown: 36:09

I'm 100%.

Meg O'Neill: 36:12

I want to get to the smashing plates now. Because sometimes you might be feeling an anger or rage that isn't necessarily related to your partnership, or it might be and you might bring something, and it can be really beautiful. Like he was so fucking phenomenal at this. Like, I don't even remember what was happening the last time you made me smashed plates, but there was like an I was angry about something. Yeah. And there was anger and rage in my body. And you were just like, we're going to smash plates. And Jacob took me outside. And you just bought a bunch of like old plates that were just like ready to go. And he like smashed them. We had this concrete at the front of our house, and you were like, smash them. And I was like, No, I don't worry. And you're like, smash

Jacob O'Neill: 36:57

them up that angry.

Meg O'Neill: 37:00

And you and I, it suddenly made me feel so vulnerable. Even though I do a lot of anger practice and, and rage work in my own practice. And in my own work, there was suddenly like, such a depth of vulnerability of you just like being a meter away from me witnessing the anime, which was so beautiful. And I got to lean and I got to smash these fucking plates. And after one I was like, give me another half to two, I was like, give me another I think I did like three or four. And I go to really express and not move to the energy so much. And I think this is so important to know that whether it's like in a moment of conflict, and there is anger and rage in the room, in your partnership, or whether it's just one of you is angry about you know, maybe you'd call the ATO the tax department and something you know, you are annoyed or you're on hold for ages, and you get off that phone call and you're angry and you kind of just want to be witnessed by your partner. We can bring these more like embodiment style practices in to shift the energy really powerfully because anger is energy in motion. It's an energy that wants to be felt and express this is how we support ourselves to be liberated humans, we meet the energy that's alive in our body. And we say FUCK YES to expressing it. Right? And then other times, you've invited me into the room and you've been like scream into a pillow. Right? And, and this is like, where we get to bring such incredible leadership into our partnership in these moments when we can see our partner being challenged by the energy of anger. We can really commit to being a space for them to express that in the moment.

Jacob O'Neill: 38:40

Totally. Yeah, and this is I think the more you become comfortable with you with your own anger, the sorry, not your own anger, but the anger that moves through you. You become so much more comfortable with anger as an energy. Yeah, whether it's in your partner, whether it's in a client, whether it's in someone down the street. And because we've deepened beneath what's what, you know, the anger is there to take us deeper take us into something deeper. Where you know, it's much easier for us to okay cool. What it Why Why is this here and what is it trying to tell me? Why and that is like, and more not only what is it trying to tell me? What does it need to move right now? Does it need to play to be smashed? Does it need me to scream into a pillow doesn't need me to go for a run? Do I need to fucking walk? Do I need to take the rest of the day off? Does this need space to breathe? And when we treat anger with respect, and we honor it as an emotion that wants to move it is it is a Connecticut emotion. It's not a stagnant passive emotion. We we were really speaking to the part but the piece beneath that as well. When we honor and respect anger, we're speaking to what's beneath it as well. Which for me, the smoothie smashing everywhere. Like the piece Beneath that is the part of me that doesn't feel worthy. And the part of me that thinks that I always have to be perfect Misaka you don't have to be perfect all the time, Jacob. And then it's like, okay. Okay, this movie is not okay, I can claim that all right, the world's not going to end, all right, I'm not, I'm still going to be loved. And this is like this, what I'm learning myself. And I feel our relationship is really holding the frequency. And the intention is that if you bring your anger to this space, I'm going to learn how to love you better. Because what's beneath that anger is a part of you that you haven't fully loved yet. And you haven't fully accepted. And I get to be the person that gives you permission in a judgment free way to bring that to the surface, and have it witnessed and seen in the way that it always wanted to be witnessed and seen. And that's a gift, like that's healing, like, that's your relationship as a as a spiritual practice.

Meg O'Neill: 40:50

And if we continue patterns of projection, whenever we're offering ourselves or our partner that gift, never, we're never actually creating the opportunity to see what is underneath it. Because we're not owning it. It's like, that's yours, you did this to me change that behavior. So I don't feel angry anymore. Right? And we're never getting the opportunity to see the pattern or the, you know, the wound or whatever it is, or the desire or the yearning or the ache underneath that correct? Yeah. I do just want to preface that, you know, if you're in partnership, and you're feeling deeply unsafe, if there is behaviors from your partner that are deeply unsafe, you know, we're not saying to stay and hold space and witness your partner in that energy, you're allowed to remove yourself from environments or situations that don't feel safe at all. Right? I want to bring that there's a difference between that and what I shared earlier of me being in the car where I did feel unsafe, but that unsafe, or that lack of safety with the smoothie and you punching the wheel. That wasn't necessarily because your behavior was projected at me. That was my relationship with anger. Yes. So there's two different things happening. Sometimes we can feel unsafe, because we've internalized this story of any, any ounce of that anger is unsafe, or any ounce of that energy is unsafe for me to be around. And we're not actually able to build a relationship with clean anger. Yes. Right. But then the other end of the spectrum is sometimes there is going to be energy and behavior that we are fucking no to, and when not available for. And I just want to remind both men and women that if that is the case, you are allowed to remove yourself from, you know, those relationships, or just, you know, a moment like that. Yes, I think that's just an important nuance to bring any now.

Jacob O'Neill: 42:48

That's a perfect nuance, because yeah, they, we, we don't want to think that you just accept all types of anger. No, that's not that's definitely not it. Like you, you get to discern what's what's what's someone continually projecting and putting walls up and blaming, blaming, attacking, attacking, versus someone who's like, in a moment where they've, where they've felt anger, and they brought it through their body. And that's, that's totally two totally different things. And that's where discernment and your own relationship with with your with the anger that moves through you, that's where this becomes, always comes back to self, it always comes back to self. So regardless of how you're showing up, if I don't have a healthy relationship with my anger, I'm never going to be able to hold you in yours. I'm never going to be able to bring mine through cleanly in a way that feels in a way that feels honoring of myself and our relationship. Yeah, completely.

Meg O'Neill: 43:49

Yeah. This one's for the women listening because I know a lot of women that I work with and that come into my world are like, Oh my god, I would love that. You know, I would love my partner to be able to say come and smash plates, or I would love my partner to witness me and my anger but like, How the fuck do I get there? And my invitation to you would be next time you're feeling anger and this doesn't need to be something that your partner you know, anything to do with the partnership. It might be you know, something in your business has pissed you off or a conversation you've had with a family member, right? Whenever there's just that texture in your body. I invite you to go to your partner and say, Hey, I've got anger here. Is anger alive in me right now. Ken Would you be open to just like witnessing me or watching me as I as I feel it that feels really edgy but also something I really want to I really want to do with you. It's is that something you'd be open to? And that might be you just like sitting on the couch or grabbing a pillow and screaming into a pillow as your partner watches you. On that might be you. That might be you putting on a crazy song I think I've got on my Spotify this Like primal awakening that podcast go and find it. And it's got epic songs that I love just like shaking and screaming to doing anger practices to, and that might just be putting on like a wild song and like shaking. And just like making wild primal noises and having your partner witness you as you kind of like shake up and meet that energy, like you said, it's it's like, it's a kinetic energy it wants to move it wants to it wants to be expressed. So that can be really beautiful. And it's probably going to feel edgy, and maybe awkward, and your partner might feel awkward as fuck your partner might be like, What do I do with this, but this is really, you know, I say this all the time that awkward is the price we pay to be fully expressed. And especially in partnerships. So no doubt, there were many moments in our relationship where, you know, you didn't know what to do with parts of my expression, or I felt really uncomfortable bringing parts of myself in. But we lent in in those moments, and we were willing to feel awkward or uncomfortable, so that we can be fucking smashing plates in our front yard and me screaming. Totally.

Jacob O'Neill: 46:04

And we took it and we took it one step at a time. Yeah, it wasn't like we were just like, here's all of the anger that I've ever felt that they have, because it's an ongoing practice. Yeah, so you know, bite, bite off the sizes that you can do, the chunks that you can digest, like, don't create, you know, create moments of courage, which is vulnerability and action, not moments of chaos. Yeah, and that's that, like Mike said, like, what she shared, that might feel a little awkward or a little bit edgy for you, that's the that is the meter, that is the parameter that you're looking for. Because if it does feel a little edgy, and you do feel a little exposed, that means that there's vulnerability in the space, that means that there's some truth wanting to come through. Yeah, that's always going to be a beautiful point. So if you're bringing something to your partner, and you feel less connected to them, after you share it, there's probably more of a projection going on or an expectation versus when you come in, and there's an edginess and a vulnerability and a, almost like a fumbling as you lean in. That's a sign that hey, I'm, I'm doing something that is rewriting the fucking program right now. And that's, that's, I just think that is such a beautiful, beautiful measure. If you're looking for, oh, how does it? How do I do this? Or what? What exactly do I say? No, no, no. Can you feel the part of you that's a little awkward or a little nervous to share this with your partner in this way?

Unknown: 47:25

Oh, I love that. I love that so much. Yeah. Anything else you want to bring around and go.

Jacob O'Neill: 47:32

If you feel you have a lot of anger, like it's great to have your own practice, or it's great to go and find, you know, a community or workshop that you can do that, or, or you know, like a circle or a Brotherhood or sisterhood where you can, like, unpack this whole concept. I know for me, when we run sacred rage, we give guys like for four or five hours of understanding all of these different concepts so they can map it all out in their head and understand Ah, okay, so anger isn't actually a bad thing. It's a part of the whole. And the more that I relate with it, the more I get access to all these other things. Wow. Okay, so it's an access for art. Okay, cool. All right. Okay, I'm ready to start to work with my anger now. Yes. And I'm sure this is the same for you in full spectrum woman, it's like to be a full spectrum woman, part of the full spectrum is this part of life. So to understand those things, we must and this is the thing like if your relationship is not fully ready for it, go and go and find someone that can do this work for yourself first.

Meg O'Neill: 48:35

I would I would say that's actually a prerequisite if you haven't done this work within yourself. Go and do this in your own body. I just you know, we do this work in full spectrum woman you do it in savage and sacred, don't you? Yeah. Also at your the gathering of men? Correct. So there's many different spaces you can go to build a deeper relationship with anger in your own body and be able to own that expression in your own body and then bring it into partnership. Oh, yeah. One of my favorite things is whenever I do a rage practice inside full spectrum woman with the women, they're my favorite, because so many you know, this is huge for both men and women. But a lot of the time women are taught that's just not an emotion we're allowed to have. Right? That doesn't make us a good woman. And women at the end of a practice like that. Majority of the time, they're their responses. Oh my god, I've never felt more powerful. All my God I've never felt so like free or liberated or alive. And the aliveness like anger is a part of that emotion is like passion. What's beneath that is passion. Why like fucking caring about something, something's motherfucking important to us. And so when we're when we unleashed that in a way that isn't projecting it but in a way that's just embodying it and allowing it to take up space in our body. You know, we're able to connect to that aliveness, sometimes we have to go through the port Love grief which is underneath anger to then connect to the aliveness sometimes there's many different layers underneath the anger but there is such a I just I just love that

Jacob O'Neill: 50:10

grief is aliveness I would argue

Meg O'Neill: 50:12

yeah I would I would I yeah I would so fucking a grief is the depth of my grief I feel most alive it's

Jacob O'Neill: 50:19

what reveals beauty like Grief is the Thing that reveals beauty like yeah like even recently with your Can we speak about the last week yeah like your grandmother passing that was like in the grief of sitting in that room with you and your family there was like this beauty that just started to emanate from the special and I started to see all the beautiful things about your grandmother I sad to see all the beautiful things about your mother and her sisters are sad to see all the beautiful things about you and start to cherish them and it was only through grief that that level of beauty became unlocked. Amen and you know my sister just had her first child a little baby boy still unnamed are hoping for a name shortly but the thing that you know I saw and I was like It's like the the love and like the grit yet she had to like like die as the was it the main the main and to become the mother's death was grief that unlocked the beauty of motherhood as like all of the things that were the you have to go through to get to that point yeah there's a grieving and letting go to then arrive at this beauty and I think that's like grief is like the key to aliveness in my opinion.

Unknown: 51:26

I love that so much. Giving giving a you go I could speak about grief all day.

Jacob O'Neill: 51:30

I love it. Yeah.

Meg O'Neill: 51:32

I think giving ourselves over to any emotion is aliveness yeah

Unknown: 51:38

yeah. Ah, okay.

Jacob O'Neill: 51:43

And the final piece around like, because anger is like we said a kinetic emotion is that wants to move it doesn't it's not a sort of stagnant or, or passive emotion. Like when you move it it creates momentum it creates friction because fire creates life. So for me like anger is when once it becomes more integrated and clean it becomes becomes your lifeforce energy becomes the thing that you you direct into your creations, whether that's your family, your work your own personal practices or personal goals is the thing that you use to cultivate the the energy to give to those things. So in its most healthiest form becomes this lifeforce, it becomes this life giving this vital energy that goes into the things that you're creating, yes, all the things that you're serving. That's why it's such an important emotion to relate with.

Meg O'Neill: 52:35

And I would say if you're someone that struggles with anger, and what I mean by that is struggles with projecting anger, or explosive anger in your relationship or in your life, I would begin Yes, I would begin to build a relationship with anger outside of those explosive moments. So, you know, come into full spectrum woman, let's do our rage practice, or go and see Jacob and you can learn sacred rage. But building a relationship with anger outside of those very reactive, intensified amplified moments is really important. And then on top of that, when, when an explosive moment is happening, you know, you're not always going to be able to stop it when that's a pattern. But in those moments, being able to ask the question, what's underneath this? What's underneath this, what's underneath this, this can really support you know, that turning into a bigger explosion, and a bigger, you know, projection of energy onto someone else. 100% can bring you back into the body of like this as mine, what what is fully here for me in this moment?

Unknown: 53:39

Yes.

Meg O'Neill: 53:43

Love that. Okay, so really, to sum it all up, anger can be such a beautiful gift in relationship. And this isn't something we have to bypass or you know, shame, shame, or remove from ourselves, or our partnership, or our partner. But this is actually something that we can bring in and, and get to a place and again, this comes from our own individual relationships with anger in our own body, but get to a place where it's just a welcomed emotion. Ya know, now we love our partner in that that expression and feeling of anger, again, not projection of anger, but expression and feeling of anger.

Jacob O'Neill: 54:22

And it's no longer good, bad, right or wrong. It just is the anger and it's here and we're witnessing it. We're not judging it. We're not in on the same token we don't like over celebrated all the way down. Oh, you're so angry, well done. We don't patronize we were like, just we witnessed it, we observe it, we allow it to move through the space. Yeah. And this is really important and like makes it I think the key thing here to remember is like ensuring those the difference between between clean and unclean, anger and ensuring that when you are expressing your anger, it is an expression, not a projection. And the way that you know that it's an expression is it is it feels a little vulnerable. There's a little feeling of exposing yourself there. Yeah. which is really what we have what courage is the courage to do something vulnerable. And that's a really important piece to remember. So I'm happy, happy anger experiencing be raging. Happy, raging. Yeah,

Meg O'Neill: 55:16

we love you. We will be seeing you next week we got an epic guest episode next week

Jacob O'Neill: 55:21

epic guest we have Damian bola coming through. Gonna be having some deep chats around the energetics of polarity and some really, really cool I'm so excited to have him on. I'm

Meg O'Neill: 55:29

so excited for that conversation. And then the following week, we'll have our three live podcast episodes

Jacob O'Neill: 55:35

yet the three part series, bring it on

Meg O'Neill: 55:37

and head to the show notes because we've got a bunch of things going on full spectrum woman join the waitlist, its doors opening really soon,

Jacob O'Neill: 55:45

you got the whole thing launching, there's a big new launch happening,

Meg O'Neill: 55:47

I got a whole website launching. So there's gonna be a bunch of freebies and lots of different things that you can be a part of. You got the gathering of men coming up later in the year. Yeah, go and check the show notes because there's Yeah, lots of goodness.

Jacob O'Neill: 55:59

All the fun stuff.

Meg O'Neill: 56:00

We love you. Part of this community. We'll see you soon. Big Love.

Jacob O'Neill: 56:08

Yo, yo, yo, thank you so much for tuning in to another episode of sex, love and everything in between. Now if you'd like to stay connected with Megan, I You can head on over to Instagram and follow me at the Jacob O'Neill and where can people find you lover

Meg O'Neill: 56:22

at the dot mag dot o

Jacob O'Neill: 56:26

amazing and yeah, guys, check out the show notes for all other information in regards to what we've got coming up. And yeah, we're super super grateful that you guys for taking the time to listen in to this podcast. If you do have any topics or any questions, like I said, hit us up on Instagram and we'll see what we can do. Apart from that have a beautiful, beautiful

Meg O'Neill: 56:45

rest of your day. Thanks for being here.

Jacob O'Neill: 56:47

Big Big Love.